[Pitch] Move All Discussions To Github Issues


(Mohamed Ebrahim Afifi) #1

Hi,

This is actually not a proposal to improve Swift, it is actually a proposal
to improve the way we use it to improve Swift. :slight_smile:

It is extremely hard to monitor discussions going over e-mails.

聽聽聽1. I always get lost between e-mails especially if there are so many
聽聽聽replies
聽聽聽2. It is extremely hard to reach the original idea/first e-mail.
聽聽聽3. New people (like me) usually get lost between e-mails and only focus
聽聽聽on their own idea and don't care about other's ideas because for example, I
聽聽聽don't know how to reply to an idea if I'm not subscribed to the mailing
聽聽聽list. In other words, It鈥檚 not a system that encourages follow-up actions.
聽聽聽4. You can not browse subjects and all replies in one place.
聽聽聽5. You cannot follow a specific topic and ignore others.

That was the problem!

My suggestion is to move all discussions from this mailing list to GitHub
issues. For the following reasons.

聽聽聽1. Easier to browse all topics.
聽聽聽2. You can see open topics and closed topics. So, if a topic is done we
聽聽聽can close it.
聽聽聽3. You can subscribe to a topic and follow all replies and reply.
聽聽聽4. Markdown support. Currently, I see people create a markdown page on
聽聽聽Github and send a link to it on the mailing list. But having the markdown
聽聽聽inline in the topic is a great benefit. Also, replies can be in markdown as
聽聽聽well.
聽聽聽5. It's closer to Proposals (Since we already using Github for tracking
聽聽聽proposals why don't we use it also to track pitching ideas). People like to
聽聽聽have everything gathered together in one place and don't need to remember
聽聽聽the Github repo and mailing list.
聽聽聽6. Github has https://developer.github.com/v3/issues/

I think using Github issues instead of the mailing lists will increase
the engagement of the Swift community with proposals.

Best Regards,
Mohamed Afifi


(Adrian Zubarev) #2

Hi there,

you鈥檙e a bit too late. A forum will come at some point (Discourse).

Best regards,

路路路

--
Adrian Zubarev
Sent with Airmail

Am 1. Mai 2017 um 13:30:55, Mohamed Ebrahim Afifi via swift-evolution (swift-evolution@swift.org) schrieb:

Hi,

This is actually not a proposal to improve Swift, it is actually a proposal to improve the way we use it to improve Swift. :slight_smile:

It is extremely hard to monitor discussions going over e-mails.
I always get lost between e-mails especially if there are so many replies
It is extremely hard to reach the original idea/first e-mail.
New people (like me) usually get lost between e-mails and only focus on their own idea and don't care about other's ideas because for example, I don't know how to reply to an idea if I'm not subscribed to the mailing list. In other words, It鈥檚 not a system that encourages follow-up actions.
You can not browse subjects and all replies in one place.
You cannot follow a specific topic and ignore others.
That was the problem!

My suggestion is to move all discussions from this mailing list to GitHub issues. For the following reasons.
Easier to browse all topics.
You can see open topics and closed topics. So, if a topic is done we can close it.
You can subscribe to a topic and follow all replies and reply.
Markdown support. Currently, I see people create a markdown page on Github and send a link to it on the mailing list. But having the markdown inline in the topic is a great benefit. Also, replies can be in markdown as well.
It's closer to Proposals (Since we already using Github for tracking proposals why don't we use it also to track pitching ideas). People like to have everything gathered together in one place and don't need to remember the Github repo and mailing list.
Github has https://developer.github.com/v3/issues/

I think using Github issues instead of the mailing lists will increase the engagement of the Swift community with proposals.

Best Regards,
Mohamed Afifi
_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution


(Mohamed Ebrahim Afifi) #3

Thanks for your reply! I think that is very good news that the burden of
the mailing list is so obvious for everyone!

I think Github issues would be better though, the community is used to it
and it makes more sense as it needs almost no configurations, no operation
costs or maintenance. If the community decided to move to it we can move to
it immediately, we don't need to wait. It is a natural next step since the
proposals are maintained there and Swift itself is maintained there.

Do you have a link to that discussion?

Best Regards,
Mohamed Afifi

路路路

On Mon, May 1, 2017 at 1:33 PM, Adrian Zubarev < adrian.zubarev@devandartist.com> wrote:

Hi there,

you鈥檙e a bit too late. A forum will come at some point (Discourse).

Best regards,

--
Adrian Zubarev
Sent with Airmail

Am 1. Mai 2017 um 13:30:55, Mohamed Ebrahim Afifi via swift-evolution (
swift-evolution@swift.org) schrieb:

Hi,

This is actually not a proposal to improve Swift, it is actually a
proposal to improve the way we use it to improve Swift. :slight_smile:

It is extremely hard to monitor discussions going over e-mails.

聽聽聽1. I always get lost between e-mails especially if there are so many
聽聽聽replies
聽聽聽2. It is extremely hard to reach the original idea/first e-mail.
聽聽聽3. New people (like me) usually get lost between e-mails and only
聽聽聽focus on their own idea and don't care about other's ideas because for
聽聽聽example, I don't know how to reply to an idea if I'm not subscribed to the
聽聽聽mailing list. In other words, It鈥檚 not a system that encourages follow-up
聽聽聽actions.
聽聽聽4. You can not browse subjects and all replies in one place.
聽聽聽5. You cannot follow a specific topic and ignore others.

That was the problem!

My suggestion is to move all discussions from this mailing list to GitHub
issues. For the following reasons.

聽聽聽1. Easier to browse all topics.
聽聽聽2. You can see open topics and closed topics. So, if a topic is done
聽聽聽we can close it.
聽聽聽3. You can subscribe to a topic and follow all replies and reply.
聽聽聽4. Markdown support. Currently, I see people create a markdown page on
聽聽聽Github and send a link to it on the mailing list. But having the markdown
聽聽聽inline in the topic is a great benefit. Also, replies can be in markdown as
聽聽聽well.
聽聽聽5. It's closer to Proposals (Since we already using Github for
聽聽聽tracking proposals why don't we use it also to track pitching ideas).
聽聽聽People like to have everything gathered together in one place and don't
聽聽聽need to remember the Github repo and mailing list.
聽聽聽6. Github has https://developer.github.com/v3/issues/

I think using Github issues instead of the mailing lists will increase
the engagement of the Swift community with proposals.

Best Regards,
Mohamed Afifi
_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution


(Muse M) #4

All of your points have been discussed and some of us will prefer Discourse
to generate mailing format. I remember there is an option for "Mailing List
mode" in Discourse.

You can trace from this discussion and there were a long separate threads
few months back which you can trace manually.
https://lists.swift.org/pipermail/swift-evolution/Week-of-Mon-20170206/031657.html

路路路

On Mon, May 1, 2017 at 8:40 PM, Mohamed Ebrahim Afifi via swift-evolution < swift-evolution@swift.org> wrote:

Thanks for your reply! I think that is very good news that the burden of
the mailing list is so obvious for everyone!

I think Github issues would be better though, the community is used to it
and it makes more sense as it needs almost no configurations, no operation
costs or maintenance. If the community decided to move to it we can move to
it immediately, we don't need to wait. It is a natural next step since the
proposals are maintained there and Swift itself is maintained there.

Do you have a link to that discussion?

Best Regards,
Mohamed Afifi

On Mon, May 1, 2017 at 1:33 PM, Adrian Zubarev < > adrian.zubarev@devandartist.com> wrote:

Hi there,

you鈥檙e a bit too late. A forum will come at some point (Discourse).

Best regards,

--
Adrian Zubarev
Sent with Airmail

Am 1. Mai 2017 um 13:30:55, Mohamed Ebrahim Afifi via swift-evolution (
swift-evolution@swift.org) schrieb:

Hi,

This is actually not a proposal to improve Swift, it is actually a
proposal to improve the way we use it to improve Swift. :slight_smile:

It is extremely hard to monitor discussions going over e-mails.

聽聽聽1. I always get lost between e-mails especially if there are so many
聽聽聽replies
聽聽聽2. It is extremely hard to reach the original idea/first e-mail.
聽聽聽3. New people (like me) usually get lost between e-mails and only
聽聽聽focus on their own idea and don't care about other's ideas because for
聽聽聽example, I don't know how to reply to an idea if I'm not subscribed to the
聽聽聽mailing list. In other words, It鈥檚 not a system that encourages follow-up
聽聽聽actions.
聽聽聽4. You can not browse subjects and all replies in one place.
聽聽聽5. You cannot follow a specific topic and ignore others.

That was the problem!

My suggestion is to move all discussions from this mailing list to GitHub
issues. For the following reasons.

聽聽聽1. Easier to browse all topics.
聽聽聽2. You can see open topics and closed topics. So, if a topic is done
聽聽聽we can close it.
聽聽聽3. You can subscribe to a topic and follow all replies and reply.
聽聽聽4. Markdown support. Currently, I see people create a markdown page
聽聽聽on Github and send a link to it on the mailing list. But having the
聽聽聽markdown inline in the topic is a great benefit. Also, replies can be in
聽聽聽markdown as well.
聽聽聽5. It's closer to Proposals (Since we already using Github for
聽聽聽tracking proposals why don't we use it also to track pitching ideas).
聽聽聽People like to have everything gathered together in one place and don't
聽聽聽need to remember the Github repo and mailing list.
聽聽聽6. Github has https://developer.github.com/v3/issues/

I think using Github issues instead of the mailing lists will increase
the engagement of the Swift community with proposals.

Best Regards,
Mohamed Afifi
_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution


(Mohamed Ebrahim Afifi) #5

Very nice! Thank you!

Best Regards,
Mohamed Afifi

路路路

On Mon, May 1, 2017 at 3:50 PM, Muse M <james.lei65@gmail.com> wrote:

All of your points have been discussed and some of us will prefer
Discourse to generate mailing format. I remember there is an option for "Mailing
List mode" in Discourse.

You can trace from this discussion and there were a long separate threads
few months back which you can trace manually.
https://lists.swift.org/pipermail/swift-evolution/
Week-of-Mon-20170206/031657.html

On Mon, May 1, 2017 at 8:40 PM, Mohamed Ebrahim Afifi via swift-evolution > <swift-evolution@swift.org> wrote:

Thanks for your reply! I think that is very good news that the burden of
the mailing list is so obvious for everyone!

I think Github issues would be better though, the community is used to it
and it makes more sense as it needs almost no configurations, no operation
costs or maintenance. If the community decided to move to it we can move to
it immediately, we don't need to wait. It is a natural next step since the
proposals are maintained there and Swift itself is maintained there.

Do you have a link to that discussion?

Best Regards,
Mohamed Afifi

On Mon, May 1, 2017 at 1:33 PM, Adrian Zubarev < >> adrian.zubarev@devandartist.com> wrote:

Hi there,

you鈥檙e a bit too late. A forum will come at some point (Discourse).

Best regards,

--
Adrian Zubarev
Sent with Airmail

Am 1. Mai 2017 um 13:30:55, Mohamed Ebrahim Afifi via swift-evolution (
swift-evolution@swift.org) schrieb:

Hi,

This is actually not a proposal to improve Swift, it is actually a
proposal to improve the way we use it to improve Swift. :slight_smile:

It is extremely hard to monitor discussions going over e-mails.

聽聽聽1. I always get lost between e-mails especially if there are so many
聽聽聽replies
聽聽聽2. It is extremely hard to reach the original idea/first e-mail.
聽聽聽3. New people (like me) usually get lost between e-mails and only
聽聽聽focus on their own idea and don't care about other's ideas because for
聽聽聽example, I don't know how to reply to an idea if I'm not subscribed to the
聽聽聽mailing list. In other words, It鈥檚 not a system that encourages follow-up
聽聽聽actions.
聽聽聽4. You can not browse subjects and all replies in one place.
聽聽聽5. You cannot follow a specific topic and ignore others.

That was the problem!

My suggestion is to move all discussions from this mailing list to
GitHub issues. For the following reasons.

聽聽聽1. Easier to browse all topics.
聽聽聽2. You can see open topics and closed topics. So, if a topic is done
聽聽聽we can close it.
聽聽聽3. You can subscribe to a topic and follow all replies and reply.
聽聽聽4. Markdown support. Currently, I see people create a markdown page
聽聽聽on Github and send a link to it on the mailing list. But having the
聽聽聽markdown inline in the topic is a great benefit. Also, replies can be in
聽聽聽markdown as well.
聽聽聽5. It's closer to Proposals (Since we already using Github for
聽聽聽tracking proposals why don't we use it also to track pitching ideas).
聽聽聽People like to have everything gathered together in one place and don't
聽聽聽need to remember the Github repo and mailing list.
聽聽聽6. Github has https://developer.github.com/v3/issues/

I think using Github issues instead of the mailing lists will increase
the engagement of the Swift community with proposals.

Best Regards,
Mohamed Afifi
_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution