RFC: making Swift.org a more valuable resource for the Swift community

(Tim Buchheim) #42

That app is a rather thin wrapper around a web view but it is still useful in that it provides push notifications. (I tend to just use Safari most of the time but I have the app installed for notifications.)

(Chris Lattner) #43

FWIW, we have a changelog to capture this sort of stuff. I'm not sure how carefully it is kept up to date though.


(アンドレカンドレ) #44

Maybe a bit off-topic: This is just my feeling, but at some point I feel Swift will have to move to a “Swift Foundation” at some point... something akin to the RISC-V Foundation.

As someone who really loves Swift, it would break my heart if Google (for example) forked Swift (a la webkit) because it was “controlled” by apple, and it would be a real shame if no large competitor to Apple also didn’t adopt it for the same reasons...

(Goffredo Marocchi) #45

Betting on easy JS transpiling (Kotlin has free capable web playgrounds) and WASM integration, JVM languages support (it can mix with Java codebases), as well as being from a third party is surely helping Kotlin grow very very fast... not to mention the ability to use Kotlin on both Android and iOS (closer to a first class citizen support than Swift for Android is... any plans to change that? Working with Jetbrains and possibly Google?)

A well funded foundation and Apple’s commitment not to fork the foundation’s Swift vision and to promptly integrate it with Xcode would be super important for this.

One thing that would be an issue though, compared to JS and Kotlin, is that Swift will be soon integrated into the OS and this seems to me that will tie the version of Swift people develop against to iOS/macOS releases... if those OS’s were only to integrate new Swift releases for the major upgrade it would mean a single Swift release a year although maybe some minor version updates could also update the language. Sure, Java changes every two years or so, but Kotlin is fully independent from Android or Windows or browsers releases and it is helping it to evolve fast (and thanks to it being JVM based distributing binary libraries is less of a problem). How is this being addressed?

We all like Swift and a lot of us really really like macOS/iOS, but as a Multiplatform developer your choice is not about just what you like but best bang for the buck and considering the lower reach Swift has beyond iOS/macOS native apps the language needs to have a 10x productivity advantage over the competition to beat it and justify having two concurrent codebases.

I do not want to make excuses for the community, but if Swift is to become an ubiquitous language it requires strong backing and financial resources: people paid to work on Swift for Android, Windows, Linux and web JS/WebAssembly full time.


The latest blog post on exclusivity enforcement reminded me of this issue again when I tried to open the two SR links in new tabs. I command-clicked the first one and it only paused for a few seconds and then loaded in the current tab.