Official Swift Slack team?

Hello dear Swift community,

I’d like to pitch the idea of introducing an official Slack team?

Never heard of Slack before: https://slack.com

I know we might have a forum in the future + we already have swift-users, but there are might be other talks you have on your mind around Swift. For example you could share some ideas, searching for help for your project, or just chat with your favorites language community.

That will keep the evolution process nice and clean. :)

What do you think?

···

--
Adrian Zubarev
Sent with Airmail

Hello World,

-1 on slack.

From experience, unless someone (apple) agrees to pay for it, slack will get pretty useless very quickly due to the 10,000 message limit.
Also, the invite only behavior of slack would put a rather annoying entry barrier.

If I were to suggest a technology to use for chat, I would suggest using Matrix (http://matrix.org), which could be easily bridged to an IRC channel (for the old bearded folks), is quite configurable and only limited by the server physical capacity.

Guillaume DIDIER

···


ÉCOLE POLYTECHNIQUE
91128 PALAISEAU CEDEX
M. +33 (0)7 70 43 18 40
guillaume.didier@polytechnique.edu <mailto:guillaume.didier@polytechnique.edu?subject=>
www.polytechnique.edu <http://www.polytechnique.edu/&gt;

Le 30 oct. 2016 à 20:26, Adrian Zubarev via swift-evolution <swift-evolution@swift.org> a écrit :

Hello dear Swift community,

I’d like to pitch the idea of introducing an official Slack team?

Never heard of Slack before: https://slack.com <https://slack.com/&gt;

I know we might have a forum in the future + we already have swift-users, but there are might be other talks you have on your mind around Swift. For example you could share some ideas, searching for help for your project, or just chat with your favorites language community.

That will keep the evolution process nice and clean. :)

What do you think?

--
Adrian Zubarev
Sent with Airmail
_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org <mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org>
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

3 Likes

When it comes to infrastructure/dev-ops, Apple probably have people responsible for it (like Shah Mischal does the CI server); I think Chris mentioned in the last discussion on this topic that they do.
  
It would be worth getting in touch with those people and finding out which issues are blocking a switch to a platform such as Discourse.
  
For one thing, there's a huge collection of great, in-depth information on these lists; the kind of behind-the-scenes technical details that devs love to read up on (the kind of stuff you'd find on Mike Ash's blog). It's a bit difficult to find and discover these things, though.
  
Sticky posts would also be great: maybe could have a friendly reminder on swift-evo that we're only taking ABI-breaking proposals right now, or split the "pitch" threads in to a separate sub forum, or keep commonly-rejected proposal threads around so people can read *why* they were rejected.
  
There are loads of opportunities to improve the community experience, IMO. So I definitely support a move to something richer than a mailing-list, but from previous discussions it sounds like Discourse (rather than Slack) will give us lots of these benefits with least upheaval.
  
- Karl

···

  
On Oct 30, 2016 at 8:26 pm, <Adrian Zubarev via swift-evolution (mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org)> wrote:
  
Hello dear Swift community,
  
I’d like to pitch the idea of introducing an official Slack team?
  
Never heard of Slack before: https://slack.com
  
I know we might have a forum in the future + we already have swift-users, but there are might be other talks you have on your mind around Swift. For example you could share some ideas, searching for help for your project, or just chat with your favorites language community.
  
That will keep the evolution process nice and clean. :)
  
What do you think?
  
--
Adrian Zubarev
Sent with Airmail _______________________________________________ swift-evolution mailing list swift-evolution@swift.org (mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org) https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

#swift-lang on freenode is already pretty active with a lot of good discussion
if you're interested!

···

--
Keith Smiley

On 10/31, Guillaume DIDIER via swift-evolution wrote:

Hello World,

-1 on slack.

From experience, unless someone (apple) agrees to pay for it, slack will get pretty useless very quickly due to the 10,000 message limit.
Also, the invite only behavior of slack would put a rather annoying entry barrier.

If I were to suggest a technology to use for chat, I would suggest using Matrix (http://matrix.org), which could be easily bridged to an IRC channel (for the old bearded folks), is quite configurable and only limited by the server physical capacity.

Guillaume DIDIER

ÉCOLE POLYTECHNIQUE
91128 PALAISEAU CEDEX
M. +33 (0)7 70 43 18 40
guillaume.didier@polytechnique.edu <mailto:guillaume.didier@polytechnique.edu?subject=>
www.polytechnique.edu <http://www.polytechnique.edu/&gt;

> Le 30 oct. 2016 à 20:26, Adrian Zubarev via swift-evolution <swift-evolution@swift.org> a écrit :
>
> Hello dear Swift community,
>
> I’d like to pitch the idea of introducing an official Slack team?
>
> Never heard of Slack before: https://slack.com <https://slack.com/&gt;
>
> I know we might have a forum in the future + we already have swift-users, but there are might be other talks you have on your mind around Swift. For example you could share some ideas, searching for help for your project, or just chat with your favorites language community.
>
> That will keep the evolution process nice and clean. :)
>
> What do you think?
>
> --
> Adrian Zubarev
> Sent with Airmail
> _______________________________________________
> swift-evolution mailing list
> swift-evolution@swift.org <mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org>
> https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

1 Like

Maybe sending a letter to Cook asking for his small program to be financed? ;)

···

Sent from my iPhone

On 31 Oct 2016, at 08:32, Guillaume DIDIER via swift-evolution <swift-evolution@swift.org> wrote:

Hello World,

-1 on slack.

From experience, unless someone (apple) agrees to pay for it, slack will get pretty useless very quickly due to the 10,000 message limit.
Also, the invite only behavior of slack would put a rather annoying entry barrier.

If I were to suggest a technology to use for chat, I would suggest using Matrix (http://matrix.org), which could be easily bridged to an IRC channel (for the old bearded folks), is quite configurable and only limited by the server physical capacity.

Guillaume DIDIER

ÉCOLE POLYTECHNIQUE
91128 PALAISEAU CEDEX
M. +33 (0)7 70 43 18 40
guillaume.didier@polytechnique.edu
www.polytechnique.edu

Le 30 oct. 2016 à 20:26, Adrian Zubarev via swift-evolution <swift-evolution@swift.org> a écrit :

Hello dear Swift community,

I’d like to pitch the idea of introducing an official Slack team?

Never heard of Slack before: https://slack.com

I know we might have a forum in the future + we already have swift-users, but there are might be other talks you have on your mind around Swift. For example you could share some ideas, searching for help for your project, or just chat with your favorites language community.

That will keep the evolution process nice and clean. :)

What do you think?

--
Adrian Zubarev
Sent with Airmail
_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

To be fair, alongside JIRA, I think the official  Swift repository might want to use HipChat to extend and connect the two and developers inside and outside the company. Sure it is a cost, but I think it would make communication and progress happen much faster.

···

Sent from my iPhone

On 31 Oct 2016, at 08:32, Guillaume DIDIER via swift-evolution <swift-evolution@swift.org> wrote:

Hello World,

-1 on slack.

From experience, unless someone (apple) agrees to pay for it, slack will get pretty useless very quickly due to the 10,000 message limit.
Also, the invite only behavior of slack would put a rather annoying entry barrier.

If I were to suggest a technology to use for chat, I would suggest using Matrix (http://matrix.org), which could be easily bridged to an IRC channel (for the old bearded folks), is quite configurable and only limited by the server physical capacity.

Guillaume DIDIER

ÉCOLE POLYTECHNIQUE
91128 PALAISEAU CEDEX
M. +33 (0)7 70 43 18 40
guillaume.didier@polytechnique.edu
www.polytechnique.edu

Le 30 oct. 2016 à 20:26, Adrian Zubarev via swift-evolution <swift-evolution@swift.org> a écrit :

Hello dear Swift community,

I’d like to pitch the idea of introducing an official Slack team?

Never heard of Slack before: https://slack.com

I know we might have a forum in the future + we already have swift-users, but there are might be other talks you have on your mind around Swift. For example you could share some ideas, searching for help for your project, or just chat with your favorites language community.

That will keep the evolution process nice and clean. :)

What do you think?

--
Adrian Zubarev
Sent with Airmail
_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

In my opinion, real-time chat does not have any advantages for swift-evolution discussions. I am a strong supporter of moving to Discourse, though. <https://lists.swift.org/pipermail/swift-evolution/Week-of-Mon-20160725/025692.html&gt;

– Adrian

···

Wiadomość napisana przez Goffredo Marocchi via swift-evolution <swift-evolution@swift.org> w dniu 31.10.2016, o godz. 10:10:

To be fair, alongside JIRA, I think the official  Swift repository might want to use HipChat to extend and connect the two and developers inside and outside the company. Sure it is a cost, but I think it would make communication and progress happen much faster.

Sent from my iPhone

On 31 Oct 2016, at 08:32, Guillaume DIDIER via swift-evolution <swift-evolution@swift.org <mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org>> wrote:

Hello World,

-1 on slack.

From experience, unless someone (apple) agrees to pay for it, slack will get pretty useless very quickly due to the 10,000 message limit.
Also, the invite only behavior of slack would put a rather annoying entry barrier.

If I were to suggest a technology to use for chat, I would suggest using Matrix (http://matrix.org <http://matrix.org/&gt;\), which could be easily bridged to an IRC channel (for the old bearded folks), is quite configurable and only limited by the server physical capacity.

Guillaume DIDIER

ÉCOLE POLYTECHNIQUE
91128 PALAISEAU CEDEX
M. +33 (0)7 70 43 18 40
guillaume.didier@polytechnique.edu <mailto:guillaume.didier@polytechnique.edu?subject=>
www.polytechnique.edu <http://www.polytechnique.edu/&gt;

Le 30 oct. 2016 à 20:26, Adrian Zubarev via swift-evolution <swift-evolution@swift.org <mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org>> a écrit :

Hello dear Swift community,

I’d like to pitch the idea of introducing an official Slack team?

Never heard of Slack before: https://slack.com <https://slack.com/&gt;

I know we might have a forum in the future + we already have swift-users, but there are might be other talks you have on your mind around Swift. For example you could share some ideas, searching for help for your project, or just chat with your favorites language community.

That will keep the evolution process nice and clean. :)

What do you think?

--
Adrian Zubarev
Sent with Airmail
_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org <mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org>
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org <mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org>
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

+1 for Discourse

···

On Mon, 31 Oct 2016 at 17:01 Karl Wagner via swift-evolution < swift-evolution@swift.org> wrote:

When it comes to infrastructure/dev-ops, Apple probably have people
responsible for it (like Shah Mischal does the CI server); I think Chris
mentioned in the last discussion on this topic that they do.

It would be worth getting in touch with those people and finding out which
issues are blocking a switch to a platform such as Discourse.

For one thing, there's a huge collection of great, in-depth information on
these lists; the kind of behind-the-scenes technical details that devs love
to read up on (the kind of stuff you'd find on Mike Ash's blog). It's a bit
difficult to find and discover these things, though.

Sticky posts would also be great: maybe could have a friendly reminder on
swift-evo that we're only taking ABI-breaking proposals right now, or split
the "pitch" threads in to a separate sub forum, or keep commonly-rejected
proposal threads around so people can read *why* they were rejected.

There are loads of opportunities to improve the community experience, IMO.
So I definitely support a move to something richer than a mailing-list, but
from previous discussions it sounds like Discourse (rather than Slack) will
give us lots of these benefits with least upheaval.

- Karl

On Oct 30, 2016 at 8:26 pm, <Adrian Zubarev via swift-evolution > <swift-evolution@swift.org>> wrote:

Hello dear Swift community,

I’d like to pitch the idea of introducing an official Slack team?

Never heard of Slack before: https://slack.com

I know we might have a forum in the future + we already have swift-users,
but there are might be other talks you have on your mind around Swift. For
example you could share some ideas, searching for help for your project, or
just chat with your favorites language community.

That will keep the evolution process nice and clean. :)

What do you think?

--
Adrian Zubarev
Sent with Airmail
_______________________________________________ swift-evolution mailing
list swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

+1 for discourse,

···

Le 31 oct. 2016 à 18:20, Jay Abbott via swift-evolution <swift-evolution@swift.org> a écrit :

+1 for Discourse

On Mon, 31 Oct 2016 at 17:01 Karl Wagner via swift-evolution <swift-evolution@swift.org <mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org>> wrote:
When it comes to infrastructure/dev-ops, Apple probably have people responsible for it (like Shah Mischal does the CI server); I think Chris mentioned in the last discussion on this topic that they do.

It would be worth getting in touch with those people and finding out which issues are blocking a switch to a platform such as Discourse.

For one thing, there's a huge collection of great, in-depth information on these lists; the kind of behind-the-scenes technical details that devs love to read up on (the kind of stuff you'd find on Mike Ash's blog). It's a bit difficult to find and discover these things, though.

Sticky posts would also be great: maybe could have a friendly reminder on swift-evo that we're only taking ABI-breaking proposals right now, or split the "pitch" threads in to a separate sub forum, or keep commonly-rejected proposal threads around so people can read *why* they were rejected.

There are loads of opportunities to improve the community experience, IMO. So I definitely support a move to something richer than a mailing-list, but from previous discussions it sounds like Discourse (rather than Slack) will give us lots of these benefits with least upheaval.

- Karl

On Oct 30, 2016 at 8:26 pm, <Adrian Zubarev via swift-evolution <mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org>> wrote:

Hello dear Swift community,

I’d like to pitch the idea of introducing an official Slack team?

Never heard of Slack before: https://slack.com <https://slack.com/&gt;

I know we might have a forum in the future + we already have swift-users, but there are might be other talks you have on your mind around Swift. For example you could share some ideas, searching for help for your project, or just chat with your favorites language community.

That will keep the evolution process nice and clean. :)

What do you think?

--
Adrian Zubarev
Sent with Airmail
_______________________________________________ swift-evolution mailing list swift-evolution@swift.org <mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org> https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution_______________________________________________

swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org <mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org>
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution
_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

1 Like

It’s not that I want to move the evolution process into a real-time chat. I’d be totally fine if we’d get a corner on the Discourse forum to talk about anything somehow related to swift. I imagine Slack to be a corner where the community can talk about anything related to swift without the restriction the mailing list has or the forum might have. ;)

···

--
Adrian Zubarev
Sent with Airmail

Am 31. Oktober 2016 um 12:29:55, Adrian Kashivskyy via swift-evolution (swift-evolution@swift.org) schrieb:

In my opinion, real-time chat does not have any advantages for swift-evolution discussions. I am a strong supporter of moving to Discourse, though.

– Adrian

Wiadomość napisana przez Goffredo Marocchi via swift-evolution <swift-evolution@swift.org> w dniu 31.10.2016, o godz. 10:10:

To be fair, alongside JIRA, I think the official  Swift repository might want to use HipChat to extend and connect the two and developers inside and outside the company. Sure it is a cost, but I think it would make communication and progress happen much faster.

Sent from my iPhone

On 31 Oct 2016, at 08:32, Guillaume DIDIER via swift-evolution <swift-evolution@swift.org> wrote:

Hello World,

-1 on slack.

From experience, unless someone (apple) agrees to pay for it, slack will get pretty useless very quickly due to the 10,000 message limit.
Also, the invite only behavior of slack would put a rather annoying entry barrier.

If I were to suggest a technology to use for chat, I would suggest using Matrix (http://matrix.org), which could be easily bridged to an IRC channel (for the old bearded folks), is quite configurable and only limited by the server physical capacity.

Guillaume DIDIER

ÉCOLE POLYTECHNIQUE
91128 PALAISEAU CEDEX
M. +33 (0)7 70 43 18 40
guillaume.didier@polytechnique.edu
www.polytechnique.edu

Le 30 oct. 2016 à 20:26, Adrian Zubarev via swift-evolution <swift-evolution@swift.org> a écrit :

Hello dear Swift community,

I’d like to pitch the idea of introducing an official Slack team?

Never heard of Slack before: https://slack.com

I know we might have a forum in the future + we already have swift-users, but there are might be other talks you have on your mind around Swift. For example you could share some ideas, searching for help for your project, or just chat with your favorites language community.

That will keep the evolution process nice and clean. :)

What do you think?

--
Adrian Zubarev
Sent with Airmail
_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution
_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

_______________________________________________
swift-evolution mailing list
swift-evolution@swift.org
https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

The Kotlin team managed to get a free license from Slack, maybe Swift can apply for it as swell?

1 Like

I believe there are good JIRA plugins for Slack...I'm pretty :nauseated_face: on HipChat :innocent:.

I would love a semi-official more ephemeral discussion/messaging system. The forum is a better format for official discussion and review of proposals, but something like Slack would be much more approachable for those seeking help or asking questions that need some back and forth.

I know Discourse is the hot (semi) new thang in the space, but personally I would still prefer Slack. Why? Well, as is probably the case for many, I not only already have it installed, I have use it for work. I'm not really interested in yet another messaging platform pinging me constantly, which means I wouldn't normally have it open so I probably wouldn't use it.

1 Like

btw, I just found the iOS Developer Slack, 20k people, nice!

1 Like

Which I left because of too much noise, and too many people hijacking the Swift channel for random UIKit issues they don't want to solve themselves and except other folks to magically provide for them.

This is of course only my personal point of view about that slack workspace.

1 Like

Any worth alternative?

I'm surprise nobody mentioned Mattermost, which is a "Open Source, Self-hosted Slack Alternative".

1 Like

I hear about it some big problems managing user rights (eg) though

ps: by alternative I meant regarding the slack group, not the chat sw